The Seamaster caliber 352 a collectors view..

Apr 30, 2009,21:04 PM
 

Hello everyone....


We all collect differently.  I was always drawn to Omega's  Seamaster.  The first generation bumper Seamasters were introduced in 1948 using a caliber 28.10 bumper movement family.  In 1949 Omega moved over to the 3 digit caliber reference and the 330 and 340 ( sub  seconds) and the 350 ( Sweep  seconds ) calibers.   As a collector I would love to collect an example of the entire  Seamaster line.  But reality rears it head and I have to "compromise" and create a sub set that I would find interesting.

I remember reading about "bumper" wound movements.  I thought it sounded really cool.   I then kept a sharp lookout for a "bumper" Seamaster.  After about 6 months I found one, typical 34 mm in diameter with the beefy lugs and thick bezel.   I loved the case style and the feeling of the gentle thump as I moved my arm around.  The watch felt as if it was alive.  I was more then happy with this simple Seamaster that was until I read somewhere that Omega made a few with a chronometre grade bumper movement.  

Well, that did it for me.. I was on a NEW quest.  To hunt for the elusive  Seamaster bumper Chronometres and for the scope of this article I kept it to sweep second examples only.  The Seamaster chronometre were the on the market before the Constellation was introduced,  this point just pushed me harder to find them.  The case reference for the Seamaster Sweep second bumper chronometre in 34 mm case was 2520, but most of the example I have came across were in 2577 cases that I confirmed were correct ( case ref numbers are cross referenced) .   Omega also made the a "Jumbo" Seamaster bumper chronometre witha case ref of 2021 case diameter of 36 mm not counting lugs or crown and still took a 18 mm strap.  The 2021 wears like a much large watch likes a flat lug Speedmaster.  


But first lets look at the movements Omega used in the bumper chronometres.   Omega wristwatch chronometre movements in my opinion started with the 30 mm manual wind family.   The first bumper chronometre movements from Omega are the 30.10 JUB and the 28.10 JUB they were used in the Omega Centenary produced in 1948 for Omega 100th birthday.  

In this diagram you can see the lineage of the bumper chronometre movements.



The 30T2Rg was used as the basis for the regulation system known as the " Omega System"  for the deluxe finish execution chronometre. The first round of the bumper chronometres the 28.10 JUB and the 30.10 JUB has the fancy finished winding and setting wheels, the regulator was a simple stick regulation that was diamond cut.  The next generation 343 (sub seconds) , 352 ( sweep seconds )  was based the the 28.10 JUB  added the"Omega System" regulation to the rest of the deluxe execution finish.   Then the 344 ( sub seconds ) and the 354 ( sweep seconds ) were produced cost cutting measures were taken,  They are also chronometre grade but lost all fancy finished winding wheels and the "Omega System"  regulation and these parts were replaced with standard finished wheels and a simple swan neck regulation system.  The only descendent  of the 30.10 JUB was the caliber 333 .  The 333 also featured the deluxe execution chronometre finish and was only found in the large 36 mm sized sub seconds Seamaster chronometres and some large sized snapback bumpers from Omega.   

Movement shot of a 30T2SCRg for your reference.


 

The following is an Omega sales tool a "paper" model of the deluxe execution bumper chronometre. a side note shows it as a 352, but the baseplate is marked 333.












Here are Scans of the parts list for the 352










Now that we have a little background...   I started to hunt for some of the Seamaster bumper sweep second chronometres..

The bulk of the Seamaster Chronometre calbier 352 were made betweel 1952 and 1955 .

Here we have a early Steel 352 with the chronometre inscription below the center pinion.  case ref 2577 / 2520 34mm case.









18k yellow gold Seamaster 352 case ref 2520  with a uncommon  " OMEGA" applied plank dial.






18k yellow gold Seamaster 352 case ref 2520 with solid gold 18k yellow gold dial.







18k yellow gold Seamaster 352 case ref 2520 with typical silver dial and applied 18k gold sticks and numbers.









14k yellow gold JUMBO Seamaster 352 case ref 2521 with uncommon  "OMEGA" applied plank dial.  This watch wears big on the wrist !






14k yellow gold JUMBO Seamaster 352 case ref 2521 with aged cross hair dial.  On a domestic 14k solid yellow gold period bracelet. This is one of my favorites !




movement finish shows some discoloration that matches that of the dial..





18k Seamaster deluxe OT 14324 " Ultima " 352 w/ 18k solid gold dial , 18k domestic mesh 18k yellow gold band ( band is not Omega) This watch was offered with a heavy mesh from the factory and when ordered together was known as the Ultima model !






Last but not lease my only other steel Seamaster chronometre with 18k pink gold applied markers.  The dial is "peeling" but I love this one !!  case rf 2577  with calbier 352.






Ok now time for a few group shots...







Here is the gang in a period correct vintage Omega Seamaster chronometre box...



On the deck of an 1910 pond sailer !!





Oh, almost forgot Omega did make bumper Seamaster chronometres using the caliber 354 as well.   But I kept my focus on the 352 only.. why go for the standard finish when you can go for the deluxe finish !


i wanted to share with everyone on the forum a segment of my collection  ...    So stay tuned for the next  installment  Sub-second Seamater bumper chronometres.  Just remember Omega never made a sub second bumper chronometre Connie !!




Good Hunting


Bill Sohne


 
 


This message has been edited by AnthonyTsai on 2009-04-30 22:04:09 This message has been edited by Bill Sohne on 2009-05-07 06:49:09


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Comments: view entire thread

 

you are a real omega seamaster collector...

 
 By: FanFrancisco : May 1st, 2009-04:32
hi Bill, happy to see your great collection especially the cal.352, very nice indeed. reading your post, i am also keen to get one... thanks for sharing. stefan

Here is...

 
 By: mac_omega : May 1st, 2009-04:44
Hi Bill, hi fellows, here is my contribution to this thread, a beautiful Cal 352 Seamaster chronometer Ref 2520 with a Cloisonne dial depicting south America. These chronometers with cloisonne enamel dials become exeedingly rare.... here is the movement A...  

great post Bill, very informative as usual and excellent pics

 
 By: G99 : May 1st, 2009-04:58
and mac, interestingly i sent a link of a cloisonne Australia dial to AndrewD. what can you tell us about the dials. are they original or aftermarket? best Graham

It is hard to tell...

 
 By: mac_omega : May 1st, 2009-08:32
Hi Graham, as for authenticity of cloisonne dials it is hard to tell...  it is much easier to spot a redial of a silvered or black dial than an aftermarket cloisonne dial... best way would be a request at Omega/Bienne to "ask the report"... kind rega... 

Nice stash Bill...

 
 By: MSNWatch : May 1st, 2009-05:22
Here's some of mine: Stainless Steel with Guilloche Dial 14k YG in 34mm case 18k YG in 34mm case 18k YG Hooded lugs version 18k RG in large 36mm case...  

Bill, thank you for this fabulous and insightful

 
 By: Valentin Blank : May 1st, 2009-05:53
report about one of the nicest watch families Omega ever produced. Here's a shot of my bumper: Alas, it doesn't get much wrist-time lately. Thanks, Valentin...  

Wow, excellent post! Thanks! [nt]

 
 By: brandon&sophia : May 1st, 2009-09:50
No message body

Outstanding and comprehensive post!

 
 By: Tony C. : May 1st, 2009-10:47
Thanks Bill! Best regards, Tony C.

Excellent post. A classic!

 
 By: gatorcpa : May 1st, 2009-19:33
A huge amount of useful information all in one place. Thanks Bill! Interesting that the promotional material shows not a Seamaster, but a Globemaster (no-name Constellation for the US market), which of course had the cal. 352. Although not a Seamaster, my...  

Why do you think...

 
 By: mac_omega : May 1st, 2009-23:08
Hi Gator, Why do you think the Globemaster has a Cal. 352 in it? Could not find any hint in the description of the AD -  it could also be a Cal 354 with chronometer rating... Do you have other sources of knowledge besides the shown AD? regards Erich

Incog Connies...

 
 By: DeGeus : May 2nd, 2009-04:47
Erich, Incognito Constellations or 'Globemasters' were available with both calibers 352 and 354 (the latter probably somewhat cheaper to produce for Bienne). This specimen from 1952 is equipped with the 352 engine. cheers, Ben....  

I knew...

 
 By: mac_omega : May 2nd, 2009-05:39
Hi Ben, I knew about the fact that different movements were used for the Globemaster as it was the same for the early Connies. My response was meant for Gator who showed us a printed AD - and there was not a single word in the printed description about wh... 

how about these for incognito...

 
 By: G99 : May 2nd, 2009-08:45
how about these for incognito Connies. a marked Globemaster which was checked by Omega and found to be 100% original. sorry pics arent very good. Graham...  

The (rotor) movement

 
 By: DeGeus : May 2nd, 2009-09:46
Graham, is definitely Swiss (cal. 501?) but the rest of the watch is for a large part organised by Norman Morris, after 1955. see this link: http://www.snapdrive.net/files/476678/Globemasterpost.pdf cheers, Ben.

thanks for that link Ben,...

 
 By: G99 : May 2nd, 2009-11:17
thanks for that link Ben, very informative. i must admit i thought it was the other way around as i think most people do. mine was a 501 non chronometer model, exactly the same as the bottom left pic on the link. its a very rare watch to find in the UK ev... 

Sorry I didn't get a chance to reply yesterday...

 
 By: gatorcpa : May 3rd, 2009-11:53
... as I was out of town. Most Americans then (as now) didn't care which movement was in a watch, just so long is was accurate, it worked properly and had the necessary brand recognition. Which Omega certainly had back then. I've never seen a US-market Om... 

I suppose

 
 By: DeGeus : May 2nd, 2009-04:05
the vertical line of the handwound 30T2Rg is incorporated in the schematic drawing for reason of being the 'mother' of Omega's Rg fine-regulator system? Interesting presentation and nice collection!

Yes, plus the deluxe finish winding wheels and click !

 
 By: Bill Sohne : May 2nd, 2009-04:47
HI Ben Exactly, Omega took the finishing from the 30T2Rg for the 28.10 JUB and the 30.10 JUB sadly only the deluxe finish of the winding wheels. Then with the 333, 343, 352 bumpers they also included the Omega system. Best Bill

Alas, this is not..

 
 By: DeGeus : May 2nd, 2009-05:36
not technically a chronometre - at 37mm diameter however still a serious fat boy. Ref. 2482-1 with cal. 332 inside. * * * (for a long long time I was too stupid computerwise to upload any pictures, but finally it seems to come together - hip hip hurrah......  

I like these "elephants"

 
 By: mac_omega : May 2nd, 2009-05:42
Hi Ben, nice watch! I like these "elephants" - compared with other rather small Omega watches of that aera! I have a similar one 38mm in rose/pink gold. best Erich

Palmares

 
 By: DeGeus : May 2nd, 2009-09:20
This picture (taken in the Omega museum) shows a telegramm from Carlo deMarchi (import-agent for Italy -sent in the Fifties), congratulating Joseph Ory and André Brielman for a brilliant result. They were the specialists in Bienne, always busy prepar...  

This is a wonderful thread, and I'd like to thank all who participated . . .

 
 By: Dr No : May 3rd, 2009-10:15
. . . in bringing light to this subject . . . most gratefully, Art

Very interesting post thanks !!

 
 By: DrStrong : May 3rd, 2009-12:27
great reading, great job: thanks Bill ! Cheers Jeff

Fantastic write up, Bill

 
 By: amanico : May 4th, 2009-06:15
And what to say about your collection? I'm speechless, my friend. Best, and thanks for this REFERENCE Post! Nicolas

To Everyone... it makes me smile...

 
 By: Bill Sohne : May 4th, 2009-06:39
Hi all it makes me smile that everyone is enjoying this post. It is really nice for others to view what you hold dear and close to your heart and have the same reaction... I am am already working on the next one !! Good Hunting Bill Sohne

thanks, bill. that is one piece of research !

 
 By: watchyouwant : May 5th, 2009-15:43
and it´s hard work. thanks a lot for sharing and it should be in the archive. i love these vintage seamasters; the globemaster history was new to me. only sold in america ? have´nt seen one here in australia. and i can´t remember seeing one for sale in eu... 

Hi achim nice to see you here !

 
 By: Bill Sohne : May 5th, 2009-17:27
HI Achim Nice to see you here. ... Best regards bill

Brilliant post Bill

 
 By: hans_jorgen_1968 : June 6th, 2010-05:54
...good with this editors choice that brings posts worth the keeping up above the surface Cheers Hans

Cal 352

 
 By: Sohailahmed_777 : October 10th, 2012-09:21
Hi I recently bought cal 352 Seamaster ref 2577 . The omega site only shows cal 354 in this case reference (2577) . I am wondering why? Regards

Hello!

 
 By: Bill Sohne : October 10th, 2012-14:15
Hi Please post pics of your Seamaster! The Omeha database is not all knowing.... The bumper chronometre Seamasters are not common in comparison to Omeha std Seamasters and a 352. Even more so ... Just about all the steel 352 I have seen have been in 2577 ... 

pics

 
 By: Sohailahmed_777 : October 18th, 2012-00:50
hi bill, The temptation to own a cal 352 seamaster made me buy this badly repainted dial from ebay. I am hoping to get an orignal dial this cristmas from santa claus........ lol . please notice that under 2577 markings there is an " H " mark . I wonder wh...  

Great collection and post Bill

 
 By: renerod : November 9th, 2011-12:05
It is the seamaster that atracted me into vintage watches. They are beautiful and not as expensive as other iconic watches. Oh! and they are built like a tank Best. René